Four Questions with Erica Phan, Hallie Liu, and Anisha Sharda, of Hack(H)er413

Hack(H)er413 is the first all-women and non-binary student hackathon in Western Massachusetts. This year, they held their sixth annual hackathon where, over the course of 24 hours, participants were encouraged to learn and develop new technical skills, network with sponsor company representatives, and innovate with passion. 

We sat down with Hack(H)er413's Co-Directors Erica Phan and Hallie Liu and Assistant Director Anisha Sharda for a conversation about community and inclusivity. 

Erica is a senior from Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam, majoring in operations and information management and informatics. She first got to know Hack(H)er413 when she attended a virtual event her freshman year and found a strong sense of community. When the chance arose, Phan applied to be on the organizing team and has remained involved in a leadership role ever since. 

Hallie is also a senior, majoring in computer science and economics. The Belmont, Massachusetts native joined Hack(H)er413 as a sophomore, having heard about the organization through a friend; she began working alongside Erica as co-head of outreach, going on to serve as assistant director in her junior year before becoming co-director this year. 

Anisha is a junior majoring in computer science and psychology from Avon, Connecticut. She joined Hack(H)er413 during her freshman year and enjoyed the experience so much, she became interested in seeing the organizing aspect. Anisha worked as head of logistics before transitioning to assistant director. 

This interview has been edited for clarity and length.  

1. How does Hack(H)er413 and the annual hackathon foster inclusive spaces for women and nonbinary students, and why is this significant? 

Erica P.: A lot of times when we are tabling, people come up to us asking, "Why is it just called 'Hack(H)er413' when you accept men and nonbinary students--people who don't identify as her?" My answer is, we want people to learn how to be inclusive. It's not just about building community and bringing people together, it's showing them this is what an inclusive environment looks like, and this is how you can do it in the future. All these students will go into the workforce; we want to give them the knowledge to succeed in that space. 

Hallie L.: As for the actual hackathon itself, we have a lot of workshops dedicated to having people in the industry with experience speak to our students and explain what it was like for them throughout their careers--how to deal with the fact that you might be the only woman or nonbinary person in the room. Just because we have a larger percent of women and nonbinary people join our hackathon compared to others, just by attending it, you'll see a lot of people who are more similar to you. Through that, you feel the connection.

2. What does this event mean to you personally? 

Erica P.: When I started being interested in computer science, there was a lot of intimidation about who was "allowed" to be in computer science, who was smart enough--usually business students aren't the kind to fit in. I felt lonely during that time. When I learned about Hack(H)er413 and went to the virtual event, it was way more inclusive than what I'd seen at other events. I remember talking to people with economics and journalism backgrounds, and I hadn't seen those people at other events. Hack(H)er413 attracts people of different backgrounds with different skillsets, so you'll always find a place you belong. That's why I think it matters that we keep this event going: we need to include these people, so they know everyone belongs somewhere on this campus. 

Anisha S.: As a female computer science major, there are times when you'll be sitting in a classroom and you're the minority--it's intimidating to make friends that aren't mutual connections. There are multiple hackathons but Hack(H)er413 focuses on community, and so it was my first positive hackathon experience where I found enjoyment in what I did rather than stress or fear about "am I doing enough, am I good enough?" 

Hallie L.: Before I began my studies, I remember telling someone -- my math tutor at the time -- that I was going to be majoring in computer science in college. I thought he'd be excited, but instead, he made this face and said, "You're a woman, you can't learn computer science. You're too softhearted, you don't have the ability. It's a man's job, you should go into something for women." I knew there was a stigma against women joining computer science, but I never heard it coming from someone's mouth, telling me I shouldn't -- couldn't -- do it. It struck a nerve, and I feel like that's something that drew me to Hack(H)er413. Every year reaffirms how happy I am to be here; it fills me with warmth and happiness. It's a feeling of, "Oh, we really are making a difference." 

3. Can you speak to the difficulties you've experienced as women in computing?

Hallie L.: It's just the feeling of walking into a room and knowing some of the people there are looking at you thinking, "She's not as capable because she's a woman." That experience with my tutor is the one I remember the most, but there are times I'll be talking about what I've done and people will say, "You're the diversity hire." A woman or nonbinary person will face at least at one point in their career. 

Anisha S.: Being in class, sometimes you have to work twice as hard because if you ask a question, it's, "Oh, she just doesn't know what she's talking about." A lot of people I talk to feel like they have to put in extra work to feel as the same level when they're putting in twice the effort. 

Erica P.: If you think about it, we have diversity -- look at the numbers -- but we don't have inclusion. That's what we're addressing as an organization. Sure, you'll see more women in your classes, but they will be conglomerated into a different corner, separated. Why is it there's this kind of gendered divide going on? Something we want to address with our hackathon is not only accepting any gender, but also merging them into a group and creating a sense of camaraderie, community.

Anisha S.: I think the first step is acknowledging that women and nonbinary hackers do face different conditions. [For allies, it's important to] try your best to be able to recognize situations where exclusion is happening and make sure it's A) not coming from your side and B) if you're in a place where you can intervene, intervene! Also, just treat them with equal respect, don't differentiate, don't be softer, just consider them as your equal and treat them as such. 

4. How does the Hack(H)er413 hackathon build and foster a community at UMass? 

Anisha S.: We try to make sure we have a welcoming atmosphere that feels accessible to everybody. We give you a space to create without having to worry about other things. We don't ask you to pay to participate; we have a place for you to sleep. We do our best to accommodate. We don't judge, there's opportunities for everybody no matter what skill level they're at; they can find their niche and follow it. 

Hallie L.: It's okay if you don't have any experience at all in computer science or tech--we'll still welcome you, we still want you to come. We try to make tech seem more approachable to people who are outside that industry or aren't the average demographic. It's easy to feel intimidated, or like you're on the outside looking in, especially when there aren't a lot of people who look like us in the industry. You worry, "I don't know if I'll have mentors or peers that look like me." I think by trying to break down that huge wall, we're able to get people who used to not be interested because they felt like they wouldn't belong to dip their toes into computer science.